Message-ID: <004901d09c51$bb30dc90$4201a8c0@user8e280af712>
From: "G3WCB" <ganymede444@btopenworld.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
References: <CADxXMjd0qdcV0+BiGFszX2yRg_ihBGqx8MRZ-0JP_v007KykbA@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2015 11:00:02 +0100
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Subject: LF: Re: Top loaded vertical spiral antenne
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Hello, Marcel.

Gary, G4WGT has done some experiments with this sort of spiral top-load =
antenna on 136 kHz. Take a look at his web-site, page 6. See link below.

http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor/LF%20&%20MF%20Experiments%206.html

I have done a comparison with WSPR on 630m between my "standard" wire MF =
antenna and a short base-loaded vertical (not spiral wound) with a =
capacity hat. The standard antenna was a 20m long (tee) configuration =
with a horizontal section at 6m height and two topwires. The antenna had =
a vertical centre feed wire, with a loading coil in a shed under the mid =
point. The vertical section of the antenna is the only part that =
radiates. This antenna had a capacity of about 220 pF

The vertical antenna was a 5m fibreglass fishing rod with a capacity hat =
made from six 60cm long radials (wire coathangers!), with a loading coil =
inside the garage about 2m up from the bottom. I didn't measure the =
capacity of this antenna but I would expect it to be about 80 -100 pF.

I found that running the same RF power (15W) to the vertical produced =
WSPR reports that were about 10 dB weaker than the "standard" MF "tee" =
antenna. This performance could be improved by simply running 10dB more =
power to the vertical antenna! I would imagine that a spiral wound =
antenna would have a perfomance that would be one or two dB better than =
a base-loaded vertical.

I didn't do any comparison of the two antennas on receive, as I used a =
separate 60cm square tuned loop for reception on 630m

There's a picture of the vertical antenna and loading coil on my QRZ.com =
page.

http://www.qrz.com/db/g3wcb

73, Dave G3WCB IO80DI


  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Marcel Bos=20
  To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20
  Sent: Monday, June 01, 2015 10:11 AM
  Subject: LF: Top loaded vertical spiral antenne


  Members,


  My backyard is in the city 8 x 8 m.  My intention is to do some =
experiments on 472 khz.

  Ready: RX converter 0-500 khz 10 mhz osc. and K3, RX ant. pa0rdt whip =
and receiving loop


  TX: GW3UEP 100 watt, RF meter, and variometer 30 uh -600 uh


  Now i'm looking for a antenne. Found a article from Finnbar EI0CF and =
Alan G3NYK about the spiral toploaded vertical.


  Has any body tryed this antenne, is the original article availble.

  What is the distance between the wire's  of the spiral?

  Also talking about a double spiral?


  So who is gone help me out  ore has some better suggetions for a =
antenne in my backyard

  http://www.xeropage.co.uk/g3nyk/spiraltop.htm#aerials


  tnx in advanced=20


  Marcel

  PA9M



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<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Hello, Marcel.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Gary, G4WGT has done some experiments =
with this=20
sort of spiral top-load antenna on 136 kHz. Take a look at his web-site, =
page 6.=20
See link below.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><A=20
href=3D"http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor/LF%20&amp;%20MF%20Experiments=
%206.html">http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor/LF%20&amp;%20MF%20Experime=
nts%206.html</A></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I have done a comparison with WSPR on =
630m between=20
my "standard" wire MF antenna and a short base-loaded vertical (not =
spiral=20
wound) with a capacity hat. The standard antenna was a 20m long (tee)=20
configuration with a horizontal section at 6m height and two =
topwires.&nbsp;The=20
antenna had a vertical&nbsp;centre feed wire, with a loading coil in a =
shed=20
under the mid point. The vertical section of the antenna is the only =
part that=20
radiates. This antenna had a capacity of about 220 pF</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The vertical antenna was a 5m =
fibreglass fishing=20
rod with a capacity hat made from six 60cm long radials (wire =
coathangers!),=20
with a loading coil inside the garage about 2m up from the bottom. I =
didn't=20
measure the capacity of this antenna but I would expect it to be about =
80 -100=20
pF.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I found that running the same RF power=20
(15W)&nbsp;to the vertical produced WSPR reports that were about 10 dB =
weaker=20
than the "standard" MF "tee" antenna. This performance could be improved =
by=20
simply running 10dB more power to the vertical antenna! I would imagine =
that a=20
spiral wound antenna would have a perfomance that would be one or two dB =
better=20
than a base-loaded vertical.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I didn't do any comparison of the two =
antennas on=20
receive, as I used a separate 60cm square tuned loop for reception on=20
630m</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>There's a picture of the vertical =
antenna and=20
loading coil&nbsp;on my QRZ.com page.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><A=20
href=3D"http://www.qrz.com/db/g3wcb">http://www.qrz.com/db/g3wcb</A></FON=
T></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>73, Dave G3WCB IO80DI</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV=20
  style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
  <A title=3Dpa9marcel@gmail.com =
href=3D"mailto:pa9marcel@gmail.com">Marcel Bos</A>=20
  </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3Drsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20
  =
href=3D"mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=
</A>=20
  </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, June 01, 2015 =
10:11=20
AM</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> LF: Top loaded =
vertical spiral=20
  antenne</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
  <DIV dir=3Dltr>
  <DIV>
  <DIV>
  <DIV>
  <DIV>
  <DIV>
  <DIV>
  <DIV>
  <DIV>
  <DIV>
  <DIV>
  <DIV>Members,<BR><BR></DIV>My backyard is in the city 8 x 8 m.&nbsp; =
My=20
  intention is to do some experiments on 472 khz.<BR></DIV>Ready: RX =
converter=20
  0-500 khz 10 mhz osc. and K3, RX ant. pa0rdt whip and receiving=20
  loop<BR><BR></DIV>TX: GW3UEP 100 watt, RF meter, and variometer 30 uh =
-600=20
  uh<BR><BR></DIV>Now i'm looking for a antenne. Found a article from =
Finnbar=20
  EI0CF and Alan G3NYK about the spiral toploaded =
vertical.<BR><BR></DIV>Has any=20
  body tryed this antenne, is the original article =
availble.<BR></DIV>What is=20
  the distance between the wire's&nbsp; of the spiral?<BR></DIV>Also =
talking=20
  about a double spiral?<BR><BR></DIV>So who is gone help me out&nbsp; =
ore has=20
  some better suggetions for a antenne in my backyard<BR><BR><A=20
  =
href=3D"http://www.xeropage.co.uk/g3nyk/spiraltop.htm#aerials">http://www=
.xeropage.co.uk/g3nyk/spiraltop.htm#aerials</A><BR><BR></DIV>tnx=20
  in advanced <BR><BR></DIV>Marcel<BR></DIV>PA9M<BR>
  <DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV></DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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