Return-Path: Received: (qmail 90759 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2004 12:25:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ptb-mxscan01.plus.net) (212.159.14.235) by ptb-mailstore02.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2004 12:25:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 4331 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2004 12:25:12 -0000 X-Filtered-by: Plusnet (hmail v1.01) X-Spam-detection-level: 11 Received: from ptb-mxcore01.plus.net (212.159.14.215) by ptb-mxscan01.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2004 12:25:11 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com ([193.82.116.20]) by ptb-mxcore01.plus.net with esmtp (Exim 4.30; FreeBSD) id 1BHih4-000100-RK for dave@picks.force9.co.uk; Sun, 25 Apr 2004 12:25:10 +0000 X-Fake-Domain: majordom Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1BHigg-0007AN-37 for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Sun, 25 Apr 2004 13:24:46 +0100 Received: from [213.232.95.59] (helo=relay.salmark.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1BHigf-0007AC-EF for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 25 Apr 2004 13:24:45 +0100 Received: from zinc.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.148]) by relay.salmark.net with esmtp (Exim 4.24) id 1BHigc-0001AX-GT for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 25 Apr 2004 13:24:42 +0100 Received: from [213.122.124.67] (helo=rogersservices) by zinc.btinternet.com with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1BHigb-0002jo-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 25 Apr 2004 13:24:42 +0100 X-Bad-Message-ID: no DNS (rogersservices) Message-ID: <001301c42abf$a13bfdc0$437c7ad5@rogersservices> From: "James Moritz" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <742496369.20040423163034@t-online.de> Date: Sun, 25 Apr 2004 13:19:22 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Spam-Report: RCVD_IN_SORBS=0.1 Subject: Re: LF: VO1NA in 5WPM Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-PN-SPAMFiltered: yes X-Spam-Rating: 2 Dear LF Group, Very interested to see Hartmut's report of VO1NA's 5wpm signal. I have been doing some measurements on VO1NA's signal strength, and the band noise levels here over the past week or so, by getting a reasonably accurate calibration of FS vs. output on the receiving loop antenna, and plotting the signal strengths using DL4YHF's Spectrum Lab. Measuring the noise in a meaningful way depends on the context in which the measurement will be used - bandwidth of receiver, type of modulation, type of noise. I find that the noise measurement algorithm suggested by G4JNT, which Wolf has built into Spec Lab, gives a pretty good picture of the effect of band noise on CW or QRSS signals. I find that, if the noise power measured by this algorithm is scaled for 100Hz bandwidth, a 0dB signal to noise ratio (i.e. signal power equal to noise power) gives a "just about readable" CW signal under different band noise conditions, so this seems a convenient figure to use as an "audible signal threshold" - of course, anything like this that depends on the operator's senses will be a bit subjective. Using this measure, the daytime band noise level is about -20dBuV/m under quiet conditions, but rising up to about -10dBuV/m when there is thunderstorm activity. During darkness, the noise level rises to about -10dBuV/m on a quiet night, and several dB above that when there is a lot of QRN. So these are also the signal strengths required for an audible CW signal. VO1NA has typically been reaching -20dBuV/m between about 0000z and 0500z, which I guess corresponds to twighlight in Newfoundland to dawn in the UK. The best SNR usually occurs at dawn, when the noise starts to fade before the signal, and there is a narrow window where the SNR is boosted by a few dB. Over the last week or so, VO1NA has mostly been about -10dB to -15dB below the audible threshold. This gives good "O" copy at QRSS30, and would mostly be OK at QRSS3. But, at best, the signal has been about 7dB below the audible threshold. The 5wpm signal is visible as a "smudge" on the spectrogram, but so far has not been audible. So Hartmut's reception is remarkable - the SNR at his QTH must have been 10dB better than they were here, which shows the degree of variation that exists between different locations. I would be interested to know if the 5wpm signals were readable over just a few minutes, or an extended period of time? Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU