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[195.171.43.25]) by mx.google.com with ESMTP id u9si6686268wjw.151.2014.03.08.06.37.00 for ; Sat, 08 Mar 2014 06:37:01 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 195.171.43.25 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org) client-ip=195.171.43.25; Authentication-Results: mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 195.171.43.25 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org) smtp.mail=owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; dkim=fail (test mode) header.i=@comcast.net Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1WMHfT-0003i9-Ld for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Sat, 08 Mar 2014 13:51:59 +0000 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1WMHfS-0003i0-PQ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 08 Mar 2014 13:51:58 +0000 Received: from qmta04.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.40]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1WMHfP-00057Y-2V for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 08 Mar 2014 13:51:57 +0000 Received: from omta10.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.28]) by qmta04.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id b1n61n0020cZkys541rt8e; Sat, 08 Mar 2014 13:51:53 +0000 Received: from JAYDELL ([71.234.119.9]) by omta10.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id b1rs1n00M0CFS1j3W1rsjy; Sat, 08 Mar 2014 13:51:53 +0000 X-DKIM-Result: Domain=comcast.net Result=Signature OK Message-ID: <000b01cf3ad5$8ff2c1d0$6401a8c0@JAYDELL> From: To: References: <2662DF5AA7FA416CBB09CDB90BBFF7B1@White> <016101cf39df$4f4c89a0$ede59ce0$@comcast.net>, <01dc01cf3a3f$86997bb0$93cc7310$@comcast.net>, <2FC5CAB271A6437CB35A5B100185CEDA@White> <025101cf3a52$e0925750$a1b705f0$@comcast.net> <7DB9DD5669FC4C648838510DCAC08AFB@White> <75EE50F214B04B68990F70FD19D33FC9@gnat> Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2014 08:51:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=comcast.net; s=q20121106; t=1394286713; bh=1tn6WncmsxhYrw2Xd9mDTZ7r3W0HFFfOMvkLaKnIuNg=; h=Received:Received:Message-ID:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=gUGZNs3sM1uC5Nwy2wmdbtM8Ohe8AEPgnqJyZbCbARgA3/oQA1ikOQG4Tk466u6FL DL47kborLrJe9NtoPGSKl3mOi99lK2fU/KUH2zkyUWNzcl5wWEIXHMdkfjUj5au8yM kfGGdMgxetfAAPImcl2f5Zrj4p3F8BA8xMnHFmH7wfQQ0Lf/LMbVlYdzm4NQwo/ay7 L9HErQEG1EDshyxFm+WYTot9WvIfRSeYiZbqwE1hAEAKMgKd6nlo4UZVk7oHqwUW0r ppl3MtZNxmwK8eD+CFSPLSVd1EdzaR1WphaNDaMTJFvc1bBjdeQmpANGOfLaZYEwow yZV1a6z/NPD5Q== X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "relay1.thorcom.net", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Alan Thanks for weighing in. FWIW, the best receptions of SAQ 17.2 kHz at this location (up until the most recent 12/24/13) have occured during their 'late' vs. 'early' session which puts the receiving end well into daylight ... and summer reception has been generally better than winter. [...] Content analysis details: (0.0 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, no trust [76.96.62.40 listed in list.dnswl.org] 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (jrusgrove[at]comcast.net) -0.0 T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message 0.0 T_DKIM_INVALID DKIM-Signature header exists but is not valid X-Scan-Signature: e42a6a809f61188d0eb1db807c52feed Subject: LF: Re: Re: Daytime 29.499 kHz Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0007_01CF3AAB.A6BAEAC0" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.4 required=5.0 tests=HTML_60_70,HTML_MESSAGE, NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01CF3AAB.A6BAEAC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Alan Thanks for weighing in. FWIW, the best receptions of SAQ 17.2 kHz at this location (up until the most recent 12/24/13) have occured during their 'late' vs. 'early' session which puts the receiving end well into daylight ... and summer reception has been generally better than winter. The most recent reception on 12/24/13 was noticeably out of the ordinary as the best ever s/n was noted. A short unprocessed mp3 is at: http://www.w1vd.com/SAQ122413.mp3 Looking through the archives it appears there were several M class flares on the days leading up to the transmission. This latest reception might make a good 'case study' for someone with the right capabilities. Jay W1VD WD2XNS WE2XGR/2 WG2XRS/2 ----- Original Message ----- From: Alan Melia To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sent: Friday, March 07, 2014 6:54 PM Subject: LF: Re: Daytime 29.499 kHz Hi Markus this dome shape, peaking at mid-day at mid-path, is very clear on all LF and VLF plots, and yes it does get better in summer!! Also I have found that daytime mid-day levels are enhanced for a day and sometimes two days after a geomagnetic storm, due I think to the extra electron density in the D-layer from precipitated "hot" electrons.....being hot they take longer to decay than photo-dissociated electrons even at 50km altitude. The daytime enhancement can be as much as 6dB after a Geomag storm, useful but not as much as to give similar levels as night-time. The "waveguide" is also narrower in daytime, so the signal contact the lossy region more often. We have predicted these on 136 and the effect on short paths was confirmed by John W1TAG and Jay W1VD. This confirms that "ionosheric-wave" is present in daytime, and at distance it is not all ground-wave. Alan G3NYK ----- Original Message ----- From: Markus Vester To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sent: Friday, March 07, 2014 10:33 PM Subject: LF: Daytime 29.499 kHz Guess this thread needs a new title... Paul's LWPC interface is here: http://abelian.org/lwpc/ It seems that the broad midday maximum appears consistently on different medium-range VLF paths, also on most 100 kHz Loran-C traces. Simplistic interpretation: With higher solar elevation, ionisation penetrates to lower layers and produces a steeper conductivity gradient, quite in analogy to a metal mirror. However this would predict that midday reflection would be stronger in summer? Looking forward to Bob's test tomorrow! Best 73, Markus (DF6NM) From: hvanesce Sent: Friday, March 07, 2014 11:16 PM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: RE: LF: New OPERA OP/OPDS 2H tonight on 27.945 Dial Freq... Markus, I'm glad that you suggested a 2-hour time slot (if it works for Bob). Based on your NAA spectrogram (attached), the window that you're shooting for may be a multimode interference peak, which might be shifted (an hour or so?) for a Penn Yan path; and I don't know which direction in time the window would shift. Paul is doing so many things that I hate to mention this, but I wonder if LWPC would show the interference peak near 1500 UT; and if so, which direction in time the peak would shift for the Penn Yan path. I seem to remember that Paul provided an online interface to LWPC, I'll see if I can find it. 73, Jim AA5BW From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Markus Vester Sent: Friday, March 7, 2014 2:45 PM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: New OPERA OP/OPDS 2H tonight on 27.945 Dial Freq... Bob, how about a straight carrier on 29.499, from 14 to 16 UT? The narrow grabbers will be on even if I have to be away. Results may depend on the qrn situation here (aka Eu weather). 73, Markus From: Bob Raide Sent: Friday, March 07, 2014 10:29 PM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: RE: LF: New OPERA OP/OPDS 2H tonight on 27.945 Dial Freq... Markus; With you home [not at work] tomorrow lets try around that 1500. I left the signal on two nights ago till 1200 but after 0800 signal was gone till 2400 next night. What mode and what time you want signal? Bob ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: markusvester@aol.com To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2014 21:45:19 +0100 Subject: Re: LF: New OPERA OP/OPDS 2H tonight on 27.945 Dial Freq... Jim, I would think that the main difference between Todmorden and Nuernberg is that I'm into the sunrise dip an hour earlier. And my noise background is higher, so I tend to completely lose a weak signal which Paul would still receive well. Anyway looking at the attached NAA plot I'm sort of perplexed by the strong propagation during the day. If Bob decided to transmit sometime around 15 UT, there's a good chance we'd pick it up. Best 73, Markus (DF6NM) ... ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01CF3AAB.A6BAEAC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Alan
 
Thanks for weighing in.
 
FWIW, the best receptions of SAQ 17.2 = kHz at this=20 location (up until the most recent 12/24/13) have occured during their = 'late'=20 vs. 'early' session which puts the receiving end well into=20 daylight ... and summer reception has been generally better=20 than winter. 
 
The most recent reception on 12/24/13=20 was noticeably out of the ordinary as the best ever s/n was = noted. A=20 short unprocessed mp3 is at:
 
http://www.w1vd.com/SAQ122413.= mp3 
 
Looking through the archives it = appears=20 there were several M class flares on the days leading up to the=20 transmission. This latest reception might make a good 'case study' for = someone=20 with the right capabilities. 
 
Jay W1VD  WD2XNS  = WE2XGR/2 =20 WG2XRS/2   
 
  
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Alan Melia
Sent: Friday, March 07, 2014 = 6:54=20 PM
Subject: LF: Re: Daytime 29.499 = kHz

Hi Markus this dome shape, peaking at = mid-day at=20 mid-path, is very clear on all LF and VLF plots, and yes it does = get=20 better in summer!! Also I have found that daytime mid-day levels are = enhanced=20 for a day and sometimes two days after a geomagnetic storm, due I = think to the=20 extra electron density in the D-layer from precipitated "hot"=20 electrons.....being hot they take longer to decay than = photo-dissociated=20 electrons even at 50km altitude. The daytime enhancement can be as = much as 6dB=20 after a Geomag storm, useful but not as much as to give similar levels = as=20 night-time. The "waveguide" is also narrower in daytime, so the signal = contact=20 the lossy region more often. We have predicted these on 136 and the = effect on=20 short paths was confirmed by John W1TAG and Jay W1VD. This confirms = that=20 "ionosheric-wave" is present in daytime, and at distance it is not all = ground-wave.
 
Alan
G3NYK
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Markus=20 Vester
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org= =20
Sent: Friday, March 07, 2014 = 10:33=20 PM
Subject: LF: Daytime 29.499 = kHz

Guess this thread needs a new=20 title...
 
Paul's LWPC interface is here: = http://abelian.org/lwpc/
 
It seems that the broad midday = maximum appears=20 consistently on different medium-range VLF=20 paths, also on most 100 kHz Loran-C traces. Simplistic interpretation: With higher solar = elevation,=20 ionisation penetrates to lower layers and produces = a steeper=20 conductivity gradient, quite in analogy to a metal mirror. However = this=20 would predict that midday reflection would be stronger in=20 summer?
 
Looking forward to Bob's test = tomorrow!
 
Best = 73,
Markus = (DF6NM)

From: hvanesce
Sent: Friday, March 07, 2014 11:16 PM
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org= =20
Subject: RE: LF: New OPERA OP/OPDS 2H tonight on 27.945 = Dial=20 Freq...

Markus,

 

I=92m=20 glad that you suggested a 2-hour time slot (if it works for Bob). = Based on=20 your NAA spectrogram (attached), the window that you=92re shooting = for may be=20 a multimode interference peak, which might be shifted (an hour or = so?) for a=20 Penn Yan path; and I don=92t know which direction in time the window = would=20 shift.

 

Paul=20 is doing so many things that I hate to mention this, but I wonder if = LWPC=20 would show the interference peak near 1500 UT; and if so, which = direction in=20 time the peak would shift for the Penn Yan = path.

 

I=20 seem to remember that Paul provided an online interface to LWPC, = I=92ll see if=20 I can find it.

 

73, =20 Jim AA5BW   

 

From:=20 owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of = Markus=20 Vester
Sent: Friday, March 7, 2014 2:45 PM
To:=20 rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: Re: LF: New OPERA = OP/OPDS 2H=20 tonight on 27.945 Dial Freq...

 

Bob, =

 

how = about a=20 straight carrier on 29.499, from 14 to 16 UT? The narrow = grabbers will=20 be on even if I have to be away. Results may depend on the = qrn=20 situation here (aka Eu weather).

 

73,=20 Markus

 

From: Bob = Raide=20

Sent: = Friday, March=20 07, 2014 10:29 PM

To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org= =20

Subject: RE: = LF: New=20 OPERA OP/OPDS 2H tonight on 27.945 Dial=20 Freq...

 


 Markus;
With you=20 home [not at work] tomorrow lets try around that 1500.  I left = the=20 signal on two nights ago till 1200 but after 0800 signal was gone = till 2400=20 next night. 
What mode and what time you want signal?  = Bob

From: markusvester@aol.com
To: = rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=
Date:=20 Fri, 7 Mar 2014 21:45:19 +0100
Subject: Re: LF: New OPERA OP/OPDS = 2H=20 tonight on 27.945 Dial Freq...

Jim,

 

I would = think=20 that the main difference between Todmorden and Nuernberg is that I'm = into=20 the sunrise dip an hour earlier. And my noise background is higher, = so I=20 tend to completely lose a weak signal which Paul would still = receive=20 well.

 

Anyway = looking at=20 the attached NAA plot I'm sort of perplexed by the=20 strong propagation during the day. If Bob decided to transmit = sometime=20 around 15 UT, there's a good chance we'd pick it = up.

 

Best=20 73,

Markus=20 (DF6NM)

 

... 

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